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Thread: Lamborghini Aventador

  1. #11
    Senior Member am33r's Avatar
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    JUNIOR AVENTADOR

    In 2007 a company called Exact Replicas Exact Replicas Supercars produced a very limited number of body kits to transform an MR2 MK3 into a Gallardo that is not at correct specs, but rather kept the spirit of the body vastly intact – yet not correctly proportional. Gallardo replica BUILD diary starts here. Of course there were areas that didn’t get enough attention, and there were still issues to be considered mainly regarding the windshield and the dashboard fitments, that is in addition to custom grills and lights; however, the idea of making a famous super-car look out of an ordinary cool car using body panels looked nice then and still lives today in the DNA kits DNA 3Sixty Ferrari 360 kit car Build :-) also with the 355 and 360 http://www.davejoneskitcars.com/ .

    I made some calculations and revisited and revised the concept because of a major shift that took place during the past year; the introduction of the Lamborghini Aventador. But why would the Aventador be a trigger to revisit and refine the concept above?

    The main reason is that the Aventador is a sign of a new era in the Super-car and the Replica industries.

    In the super-car arena, the Ave – although still at its infancy - is a real seductive machine, and it plans to be around for a 10 year stretch. It has the look of $500K and it performs as it looks. The car’s exterior is a vigorous piece of art – just as are all Lamborghinis when debuted.

    The replica world has also advanced with multiple kits in Europe and the USA but not for an Aventador as of today (July 10, 2012). For previous models, the makers had gone after much accuracy but it seemed like many builders still faced a lot of issues – besides scams. I want to mention that I do not know what "Replica Interior of an Aventador" really means! It is because i am certain; such is impossible as for starters, where would one put the shift knob?

    Today, it might be an opportunity to draw a parallel path, one that might be appealing to a different crowd!

    The Philosophy of a Junior Super Car

    This is how I think of it: Find a modern looking mid-engine car that is within your budget (i.e. 2000-2007 MR2 MK-iii for $6,000) or maybe a Boxster; If the wheelbase of your Donor is 91% of that of the True Super Car, then mill out a body plug kit that is 91% in length, 91% in width, and 91% in height.

    Theoretically, this kit should fit your donor without a stretch, and you keep your modern interior as is with all functioning options and instruments, or modify it as you like it to be with other performance after-market parts! You do not need to buy spacers, and you could use many available 18x8 and 18x10 wheels rather than expensive ones that are 20x9 and 20x12 saving yourself a lot of money in the process. Furthermore, and as awesome as they may be, custom chassis won’t be needed! You might need to move a radiator housing back or such, but that is nowhere near a chopping problem.

    Worried about finding 91% sized set of (OEM Windshield, Other Glass, Lights and Grills)?
    There are many skilled people who have manufactured OEM sized parts and can manufacture 91% sized one too. There should be no problem here!

    The resulting 91% Ave is a 100% perfectly proportioned car made to resemble the real one, just 9% shorter, 9% thinner, and 9% lower.

    But does this 9% really matter? When, How, and to whom will it matter?

    MR2 MK-ii
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    Name:  MR2 AVE infused.jpg
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    ... CONT. JUNIOR AVENTADOR

    Couldn't attatch more than 5 pics in a post so here are the rest:

    Aventador Kit with same wheelbase as the MR2 MK-iii. Bodies Super imposed!

    Work needs be done on A Pillar.

    Attachment 20158

    Attachment 20159

    Notice how much shorter the Aventador would seem!

    The Aventador kit may actually be made 4 inches heigher (That is 100% of the actual height, not at 90% size)

    This is due to two factors:

    1. The Ave has a lifting system of 4cm to clear parking lot entrances and certain turns and bumps, and driving on turns. The average height of the car therefore is 2" more than claimed. The matter is the height of the Body itself without sitting on wheels.

    2. In a 90% sized Ave, the Wheels are 18" rather than 20" so the kit will sit closer to the ground than the original Ave already but that would cause it to scrape unless placed heigher on the donor or madeabout 2" heigher.

    True size MR2 infused with 95% Ave Kit Height, that is 5% heigher of the ground than the Ave.

    http://i.imgur.com/7qByI.jpg
    http://i.imgur.com/zIX15.jpg
    http://i.imgur.com/k6nlq.jpg
    http://i.imgur.com/BL1Nq.jpg
    http://i.imgur.com/ixoMz.jpg
    http://i.imgur.com/QtBKH.jpg
    http://i.imgur.com/updtj.jpg


    Entertaining this concept is done for now
    (: it is true that no one else is mentioning this idea, but it might become popular one day.

    From a business point of view, this approach brings about many interested clients who are avoiding the kit concept due to issues related to Stretching a Vehicle, Excessive Spacers, Expensive Large Wheels, Extreme Interior Work, and Expensive OEM Grills/Light sets.

    MR2 Mk-iii Interior
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    Am33r


    Here's a fun video of CNC Carving of an Aventador pic

    Aventador Halftone cut by DIY cnc router - YouTube

    And here's an Aventador Shaped Cake

    Sweet Cakes by Rebecca
    Attached Images Attached Images   
    Last edited by am33r; 08-04-2012 at 05:38 AM.

  2. #12
    Senior Member am33r's Avatar
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    FIERO TO AVE (Chassis Stretch Required )
    To use a Fiero for Mid-Engine Replica Project has been the most sought option for the past two decades. The vihicle has always been easily attained in the US market, and has many GM-based fixes and upgrades. It has been widly used for Diablo, Murcielago, and Ferrari replicas among other vehicles.

    Fiero On Wiki Pontiac Fiero - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Fiero Enhancing and Upgrading West Coast Fiero Upgrade Performance Parts

    The page above has catagories for Engine Swaps into some of the most common upgrades like the 3.8 SuperCharged Engine, and Axel Upgrades for Kit Cars, etc. (useful information for ideas and possibilities).

    TBC.

    In other News

    Lamborghini sold the 1000's Aventador (July 20, 2012), and continue to be booked for 18 months!

    http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2012/07...uction-of.html

    At this rate they will run out of the total 4000 cars they are planning on making by the end of 2014!

    Xool colors on the Ave and the 458

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=vXDXMSwws4k
    Last edited by am33r; 08-04-2012 at 05:38 AM.

  3. #13
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    I like the idea though I have a great deal of skepticism. As a scale model artiest, scaling things down is something I have a great deal of experience in. 30 years in fact, which means I've been doing it since I was nearly a toddler.

    Scaling things down isn't very hard in model making at least for me, but when I got in to doing the same thing in mechanics (guns) things started to get very tricky very fast. For one, part of my reason for getting in to guns is that making things that had no function became too easy no matter how detailed. The challenge goes up dramatically when you try to make it work and even more when you want it to be reliable.

    One thing that drives me nuts, which I have seen allot of in both firearms and airguns especially during my 14 years in the hobby as well as cars in my 2 months is people doing direct mods without really thinking things through about how it's going to pan out in the end, come to find that direct scaling or body swaps is going to be mechanically unsound and/or aesthetically unpleasing. For a good example of at least the later, take a look at Smith and Wesson's .45ACP version of the Walther P-99 (top) compared to the 9mm version of the same gun (bottom)



    Basically, all the really did was slightly upscale some parts, heighten the handle and adapt things to fit .45ACP. Believe it or not, in person the 9mm looks better and the .45 even worse then in the picture, not to mention as funky to handle as it looks. I myself have only held the .45ACP version, never actually fired it but everyone I know who has fired it doesn't think much of it.

    Of course, it appears that S&W focused entirely on up-scaling it and making sure it works and; as is usually the case with firearm manufacturers, paid little or no attention to the aesthetics of the handgun (which in this case negatively affected handling as well.

    Anyway, the point is that to get what you want aesthetically, things need to be carefully thought through. Direct rescaling of the body is likely to get you some surprisingly unpleasant results. One thing that makes me a good model artiest as well as firearm furniture maker is being able to look at something, think through what to do with it and accurately predict what the finished product will look and handle like. I've done the same here and; while I think whatever you do will be aesthetically pleasing, I DON'T think it's going to truly look like an Aventador.

    But there's a viable solution I think. The newer Gallardos share many features with the Aventador. In fact, in some cases, they can be described as mini Aventadors. To achieve this, Lamborghini has made some reconfigurations to the parts. What I think will be better and more likely to give you better fitting as well as more "aventador-like" appearance is to start with the platform of the newer Gallardos and modify the design to share Aventador features. For instance, start with the Gallardo vents, slope the door more inward and then add the Aventador shape to it. Front end. Same thing. Start with the newer Gallardo and adapt it to fit the Aventador's profile. When all is said and done, the actual structure will have more in common with the Gallardo then the Aventador, yet it'll probably look more like a true Aventador then a direct down-scaled version with adaptations for structural integrity and driver comfort.

    All that said, I really think that if you want the look of an Aventador without spending allot of money or overworking yourself, the Gen 4 Camaro is the way to go. It's already been done with the Murcielago (which is very similar in structure to the Aventador) and still kept attractive. My friend (who is a hobbyist car mechanic) went over Carkitinc.com's MERCY 4 and both of us, in different areas, pointed out that these guys 1, didn't think it through as much as they could have and 2, even in their own words, made it as a cheap and simple solution for rookies, acknowledging that; with a little more elbow grease, much of the car could have been dramatically improved. We also went over the fact that; if features from some of the custom Aventadors are included, namely the raised hood of the Triangle, you can get a nearly identical copy in full scale, and with up to an LS1 V-8 engine no less. And; when you consider the increase in top speed when a 20 inch rear wheel is added, you might get top speed that's up there with the real thing as well which makes sense considering that the power to weight ratio of the two is similar.

    Anyway, I know I already sent it to you but I'll share it here for everyone else. My Camaro plan compared to a regular Aventador, with all factors considered except for wheel base. Even height of the vehicle is taken in to account as well as the hood changes.



    Anyway, I like your idea and I DO think it's viable as described. If you can afford it, you might want to pick up one of those Gallardo shells and try modifying it. I might try it myself some day.
    Last edited by ronin; 07-22-2012 at 05:37 PM.

  4. #14
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    The new gallardos share nothing like the aventador.

    I don't know how you made that comparison. Literally night and day difference and basically nothing can swap with each other, maybe a switch or a engine sensor???

    What does a 9mm and a .45 have to do with things? I actually own a p99 9mm, its a fantastic gun. I wish I had a .45 but it was unavailable at the time. It has changable blackstrap, it fits great in my hand.

    You buy a gun not for aesthetics only, but if it fits your needs and your hands. Your comparing apples and oranges.

    People typically buy cars for the same thing, a purpose, needs and instead of hands, perhaps affordability within budget.

    Building a Kitcar, based upon a super car, well that doesn't fall within needs or typical affordability, but rather looks and lust of owning one.

    Oh yeah, to gain a bit top sped in a rear differential vehicle like a mustang or camaro, you swap out the rear ring and pinion gear for a "lower number" gear. Say you have 4:10 ratio rear gear and top speed is 120, if you put a 3:73 your top speed might be 130 but you lose the smash the gas low end factor.

    Not tires alone.
    Last edited by onewickedsvt; 07-22-2012 at 07:48 PM.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by onewickedsvt View Post
    The new gallardos share nothing like the aventador.

    I don't know how you made that comparison. Literally night and day difference and basically nothing can swap with each other, maybe a switch or a engine sensor???

    What does a 9mm and a .45 have to do with things? I actually own a p99 9mm, its a fantastic gun. I wish I had a .45 but it was unavailable at the time. It has changable blackstrap, it fits great in my hand.

    You buy a gun not for aesthetics only, but if it fits your needs and your hands. Your comparing apples and oranges.

    People typically buy cars for the same thing, a purpose, needs and instead of hands, perhaps affordability within budget.

    Building a Kitcar, based upon a super car, well that doesn't fall within needs or typical affordability, but rather looks and lust of owning one.

    Oh yeah, to gain a bit top sped in a rear differential vehicle like a mustang or camaro, you swap out the rear ring and pinion gear for a "lower number" gear. Say you have 4:10 ratio rear gear and top speed is 120, if you put a 3:73 your top speed might be 130 but you lose the smash the gas low end factor.

    Not tires alone.
    I am not one to insult people if I can avoid it, but I think you need to reread what I said and use your head over your ego for a change. You should have picked up on all of of this, but I guess I'll just have to spell it out for you since you can't seam to figure it out on your own.

    First, how you manage to miss the clear similarities between these newer Gallardos and Aventador is beyond me.



    "Nothing is interchangeable" are you kidding me? How much of a 90% Aventador replica is interchangeable with the real thing? What is your point?

    And regarding the P-99, good for you. I'm a fan of the WALTHER P-99 myself, particularly the 9mm and .40S&W. And it is by no means an apples to oranges comparison. Again you missed the mark entirely. The .45ACP P-99 is not exactly popular for it's great handling, but I though I made it clear that we're focusing on the unintended aesthetic consequences of simple up-scaling.

    Bottom line. People have already done Gallardo non-stretch replicas. They make a Gallardo that has allot of similarities to the Aventador. Rather then down-scaling an Aventador and risking negative unintended aesthetic or structural consequence (which I promise you will have) it is better to take the tested and proven Gallardo non-stretch platform, add the "aventador-like" changes and then further modify them to fit the look of the Aventador.

    I don't see how you were able to miss any of that. Maybe you didn't but are just looking for an excuse to be a jerk.

    A true replica you are not going to get, especially if you downscale. My understanding is the topic poster is after the aesthetic appeal of the Aventador, not exactness. The absence of exactness outlines this topic, which you throw right out the window when you talk about down-scaling. What is really more important? Accurate dimensional proportions of a scrawny and potentially weak car you can barely fit in or something of less exact dimensional proportions that preserves the spirit of the aesthetic design?
    Last edited by ronin; 07-22-2012 at 09:08 PM.

  6. #16
    Senior Member ncrazyballa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ronin View Post
    I am not one to insult people if I can avoid it, but I think you need to reread what I said and use your head over your ego for a change. You should have picked up on all of of this, but I guess I'll just have to spell it out for you since you can't seam to figure it out on your own.

    First, how you manage to miss the clear similarities between these newer Gallardos and Aventador is beyond me.



    "Nothing is interchangeable" are you kidding me? How much of a 90% Aventador replica is interchangeable with the real thing? What is your point?

    And regarding the P-99, good for you. I'm a fan of the WALTHER P-99 myself, particularly the 9mm and .40S&W. And it is by no means an apples to oranges comparison. Again you missed the mark entirely. The .45ACP P-99 is not exactly popular for it's great handling, but I though I made it clear that we're focusing on the unintended aesthetic consequences of simple up-scaling.

    Bottom line. People have already done Gallardo non-stretch replicas. They make a Gallardo that has allot of similarities to the Aventador. Rather then down-scaling an Aventador and risking negative unintended aesthetic or structural consequence (which I promise you will have) it is better to take the tested and proven Gallardo non-stretch platform, add the "aventador-like" changes and then further modify them to fit the look of the Aventador.

    I don't see how you were able to miss any of that. Maybe you didn't but are just looking for an excuse to be a jerk.

    A true replica you are not going to get, especially if you downscale. My understanding is the topic poster is after the aesthetic appeal of the Aventador, not exactness. The absence of exactness outlines this topic, which you throw right out the window when you talk about down-scaling. What is really more important? Accurate dimensional proportions of a scrawny and potentially weak car you can barely fit in or something of less exact dimensional proportions that preserves the spirit of the aesthetic design?
    hows your aventador tail light going?

  7. #17
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    Slow but coming.

  8. #18
    Senior Member am33r's Avatar
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    Ronin, I’m assuming you are addressing the “Junior Aventador” concept. The 91% Sized yet 100% Body Ave.

    I wrote about it because it was worth the little time and attention I gave to it.

    It was neither because I am an advocate of it, nor because I hated it and wanted to expose some alleged irrationality in the idea.

    As you may have noticed, I did not write of what "I think" or "I feel" or "My understabnding of the subject" and I left my opinion out of it


    So, my friend, I will be quoting from your article to properly address your concerns

    Ronin: Direct rescaling of the body is likely to get you some surprisingly unpleasant results.

    What are those?

    Ronin: While I think whatever you do will be aesthetically pleasing, I DON'T think it's going to truly look like an Aventador.

    How is a 100% exact in all shapes, angles, and proportions but a bit smaller version not look like an Aventador?

    Ronin: A true replica you are not going to get, especially if you downscale.

    Just to clarify J A Purely Downscaled Version of anything is a TRUE REPLICA. Terms like 1:18 or 1/4 are used to show the only difference; Size.

    Ronin: My understanding is the topic poster is after the aesthetic appeal of the Aventador, not exactness.
    The absence of exactness outlines this topic, which you throw right out the window when you talk about down-scaling.

    The two concepts "Down-Scaling" and "Exactness" can work hand-in-hand to avoid "Arbitrary Down-Scaling" which really preserves Nothing or the originality!

    There are two concepts of exactness here:


    1) Is the car proportionate correctly? This is the true essence of the vehicle’s shape!
    This one is the heart of the whole article, and is a new approach to address the proportion discrepancies in the two kits previously made (and mentioned in the article) for the Ferrari on MRS and Gallardo on MRS.

    2) Is the car just proportionate arbitrarily? This is like the Murci 4 by CKI

    Ronin: What is really more important? Accurate dimensional proportions of a scrawny and potentially weak car you can barely fit in or something of less exact dimensional proportions that preserves the spirit of the aesthetic design?

    I do not know where “Accurate Dimensional Proportions” correlates to “Scrawny and Potentially Weak Car (YOU) can barely fit in” came from! If you are addressing the MR2, there are hundreds of millions of people in this world who drove vehicles that are similar in size and horse power to those cars!

    In addition, what is the acceptable threshold when it comes to “Less Exact Dimensional Proportions”? and what are the “Boundaries of preserving the Spirit of the Aesthetic Design?” This is an open subject for anyone to say their opinion!

    Name:  Ronins.JPG
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    By the way. Please write a whole post on this thread about the Camaro-Ave Concept as it is similar to the Sibring-Murci idea currently entertained on the forum. Address some issues that maybe helpful to anyone who thinks about the subject, It seems your research may bring about good things (:

    Let me know if this helps
    Last edited by am33r; 07-25-2012 at 08:35 PM.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by am33r View Post
    Thank you Ronin, and the few of you, for contributing to this Journal

    Ronin, I’m assuming you are addressing the “Junior Aventador” concept. The 91% Sized yet 100% Body Ave.

    I wrote about it because it was worth the little time and attention I gave to it.

    It was neither because I am an advocate of it, nor because I hated it and wanted to expose some alleged irrationality in the idea.

    As you may have noticed, I did not write of what "I think" or "I feel" or "My understabnding of the subject" and I left my opinion out of it


    So, my friend, I will be quoting from your article to properly address your concerns

    Ronin: Direct rescaling of the body is likely to get you some surprisingly unpleasant results.

    What are those?

    Ronin: While I think whatever you do will be aesthetically pleasing, I DON'T think it's going to truly look like an Aventador.

    How is a 100% exact in all shapes, angles, and proportions but a bit smaller version not look like an Aventador?

    Ronin: A true replica you are not going to get, especially if you downscale.

    Just to clarify J A Purely Downscaled Version of anything is a TRUE REPLICA. Terms like 1:18 or 1/4 are used to show the only difference; Size.

    Ronin: My understanding is the topic poster is after the aesthetic appeal of the Aventador, not exactness.
    The absence of exactness outlines this topic, which you throw right out the window when you talk about down-scaling.

    The two concepts "Down-Scaling" and "Exactness" can work hand-in-hand to avoid "Arbitrary Down-Scaling" which really preserves Nothing or the originality!

    There are two concepts of exactness here:


    1) Is the car proportionate correctly? This is the true essence of the vehicle’s shape!
    This one is the heart of the whole article, and is a new approach to address the proportion discrepancies in the two kits previously made (and mentioned in the article) for the Ferrari on MRS and Gallardo on MRS.

    2) Is the car just proportionate arbitrarily? This is like the Murci 4 by CKI

    Ronin: What is really more important? Accurate dimensional proportions of a scrawny and potentially weak car you can barely fit in or something of less exact dimensional proportions that preserves the spirit of the aesthetic design?

    I do not know where “Accurate Dimensional Proportions” correlates to “Scrawny and Potentially Weak Car (YOU) can barely fit in” came from! If you are addressing the MR2, there are hundreds of millions of people in this world who drove vehicles that are similar in size and horse power to those cars!

    In addition, what is the acceptable threshold when it comes to “Less Exact Dimensional Proportions”? and what are the “Boundaries of preserving the Spirit of the Aesthetic Design?” This is an open subject for anyone to say their opinion!

    Name:  Ronins.JPG
Views: 719
Size:  25.0 KB

    By the way. Please write a whole post on this thread about the Camaro-Ave Concept as it is similar to the Sibring-Murci idea currently entertained on the forum. Address some issues that maybe helpful to anyone who thinks about the subject, It seems your research may bring about good things (:

    Let me know if this helps
    No problem man. Just trying to give some productive insight.

    Ronin: Direct rescaling of the body is likely to get you some surprisingly unpleasant results.

    What are those?

    You can start with the car looking much like a go cart. I think you'll be surprised how much smaller in bulk 90% really is. You are also going to have problems with some things not scaling down correctly and still remaining functional. Not to mention anyone 5.11 or taller even fitting in the car.

    Ronin: While I think whatever you do will be aesthetically pleasing, I DON'T think it's going to truly look like an Aventador.

    How is a 100% exact in all shapes, angles, and proportions but a bit smaller version not look like an Aventador?

    It'll look like a big model of an Aventador. Being as you've seen one in person, I am sure you are well aware of the Aventador's considerable size for what it is. If I remember correctly, 90% in scale is something like 50% or 60% in bulk quantity. I'll have to double check but it's somewhere around there. That's a difference people are going to notice when you keep all parts porportionately accurate. It's like the difference between a king size snickers bar and a regular one. On top of that, the things you can't downscale are going to stand out more. There's really no way around it in a 90% replica but I'm almost willing to bet money that a Gallardo mod is going to do a better job of minimizing the noticeable difference, in person at least.

    In addition, what is the acceptable threshold when it comes to “Less Exact Dimensional Proportions”? and what are the “Boundaries of preserving the Spirit of the Aesthetic Design?

    On this matter, it's a question of what's important to you. Do you want the overall look and feel of the design or do you want miniture exactness. If you want the overall look and feel, then you work at it until you get the desired results. I may have never built a car body, but modifying and scratch building things look the way you want them to and give you the desired impression is my world. I've been doing it literally since kintergarden and you're one of the few people on this board who's actually seen some of what I'm talking about. If I wanted to project the overall look and feel of an Aventador in smaller scale, I'd modify a Gallardo body design.

    I DO want to eventually do an Mr2 body mod myself, but I have my own design in mind for this. Basically a mixture of an Aventador, Sesto Elemento and Reventon. When it comes to an Aventador replica, I am pretty much comitted to the Camaro at this point.

  10. #20
    Senior Member am33r's Avatar
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    Some Aventadors Retire Early x_O

    Ave Crashes
    Lamborghini Aventador Crashes - YouTube

    Some are also found here Wrecked Exotic Cars - Pictures of Expensive Car Crashes and Wrecks

    .. Notice some Ferrari 458 crashes too
    Meanwhile, on the US Highways ... DEAD AVE WTF!!

    http://www.khou.com/video/featured-videos/Lamborghini-driver-strikes-pedestrians-other-vehicles-in-Uptown-Park-138780659.html


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=4Bl536iLL3g

    At some point, the crashed Ave will end up at www.copart.com with the rest of the Salvage Lamborghinis

    If anyone notices one on copart at some point in the future lemme know
    Last edited by am33r; 07-30-2012 at 08:48 PM.

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