Results 1 to 7 of 7

Thread: alternate hubs for rear '88 knuckles??

  1. #1
    Senior Member hillsj's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    104

    alternate hubs for rear '88 knuckles??

    does anyone know of alternate hubs that will work in an '88 rear knuckle to get 5x120 or 5x114 pattern? If so what would be the corresponding rotors/calipers? I had my suspension made +4" per side like an idiot >. I should have done +3" due to the 1" wheel adapter necessary to get any kind of width. I haven't seen any wide wheels with a 5x100 pattern.
    What was I thinking??!!  I could have a VR4 Spyder for this kind of money.

  2. #2
    Moderator FunnyWheels's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    8,151

    Re: alternate hubs for rear '88 knuckles??

    There are a ton of wide wheels out there for VW, PT Cruisers, Audi, Nissan. but they cost a bunch of cash for the wide ones.

    I used a set of direct bolt on Momo wheels with 5/120 from my BMW 540 on my first suspension build. Here is the Bill of materials for the hub conversion. You can use the brakes as well but need to get a Camero caliper to work with the GM Corvette Rotor. Don't forget the axles!

    Maybe this will make things clearer.

    Axles, Brakes and Rear Suspension

    I had to make my axles longer due to the 355 Ferrari rebody I completed on my car. The axles are 4 inches wider on each side. I used a PST (precision Shaft Technologies), Clearwater, Florida, 727-XXX-XXXX to cut, lengthen and rebuild my axles. I beefed up my hubs to handle a larger bolt pattern (5/120) and larger splines by using a set of S-10 4X4 front hubs mounted to 1989 Olds Cutlass Ciera uprights. I had to use the hub side CV joints and 1999 Buick Park Avenue axles mated to Fiero axles (same spline as the S-10 hub). The Ciera uprights are stronger castings than Fiero and can take the stresses of the 3800 conversion and larger diameter brakes. In 2000, the set up was topped of with 12 inch Wilwood brakes, Ryane Motor Sport lower swing arms and coil over shocks, 350# springs and a 1.25” anti sway bar from Dave Held. My theory is that if you are going to go fast, shift hard and corner correctly. I thought it best if I could stop on a dime and not have a desire to swap ends, as in the case with the OEM suspension. The Wilwood brake set up was used as a replacement for Chevy S-10 front disk brakes from the 4 X 4 that supplied the donor hubs for the project. These might be the same as a Camero, not sure on that fact.

    Bill of Materials

    89 Cutlass Ciera Upright Assembly ( beefed up casting for larger bearings that will handle more Horse Power) used on rear Fiero suspension build up.

    88 – 89 Chevy S-10 Front Spindles and CV Joint Assembly for
    Front Wheel drive. (Bigger bearing, heavy-duty splines, larger CV joints)

    Ciera Upright Assembly machined (drill out bolt holes) to fit S-10 Parts into Cutlass Ciera Casting. (Ciera upright castings $10.00 each side)

    S-10 Spindles and brakes $25.00 each side 4.75 bolt circle.

    99 Buick Park Avenue Axles, for used with 3800 transmission
    Custom axles, PST Engineering $400.00 Pair



    Braking System 12” Wilwood Disk Brake Package $2,855.00
    2 - 4.75 Bolt Circle Aluminum Hats Rear
    2 – 108MM and 4.75 Bolt Circle Aluminum Hats Front
    4 - 12 Inch Vented Rotors
    2 - Caliper Bracketing Rear
    4 - 4 Piston Calipers
    Two – Manual Piston Emergency Brake Calipers
    Semi-Metallic Brake Pads, Rear
    High Friction Racing Pads, Front
    Stainless Steel Braided Lines to Match Wide Track Options
    High Volume GM Truck Master Cylinder (Chevy Pick Up Truck)
    Wilwood Proportioning Valve, Front Suspension and Brakes


    Rear Suspension

    Once the parts were installed on the rear of the car, I sorted out the suspension by swapping springs and shock dampening. I wound up with #350 springs and the car lowered 3 inches. I also added a 1.25 inch anti-sway bar to the set up to keep the car as flat as I could. In 2002 “Anti-Bump Steer Correction from Held Motor Sports” were added to replace the widened Ryane Motor Sports rear suspension. It seemed to me that the car had a tendency to switch ends in the middle of a high speed turn and I really didn’t like that feeling. The way the car is set up today, the rear suspension has no “Bump Steer Effect” and tracks nicely in the corners. The suspension settings are now set as the OEM 355 not a Fiero. The difference is remarkable. All other hubs and uprights are in use as previously installed.



    Front Slalom Suspension

    This fully self contained front suspension system for the '84-'87 Fiero comprises a replacement fabricated front cross member with tubular upper and lower control arms manufactured by Ryane Motor Sports. The spindles are fabricated uprights with bolt-in bearing/hub assemblies out of a Corvette (rear hubs). The upright design resembles those found on some formula type racecars, being very strong and light, they allow a reduction in un-sprung weight and thereby improve handling. The 325# springs and HAL shocks are of the coil-over variety, with a large assortment of spring rates available and while the standard shock is a three way internally adjustable unit, there are other shock options including externally adjustable units. The standard Fiero steering rack is retained and the package is designed for use with Fiero replacement or standard sway bars (not included). I purchased an anti sway bar from Held Motor Sports in a 1 ¼ inch configuration in March of 2000 after using the stock 86 Fiero unit for 1 year. Control arm bushings are polyurethane and grease fittings are installed at all pivot points for easy lubrication, eliminating the annoying squeak normally found in urethane bushed suspensions.

    The system features purpose built geometry with excellent roll center and camber characteristics. I had mine manufactured to a width of 5 inches wider than stock to fit the 355 body conversion and Ferrari wheels. I liked the front Slalom design because it incorporates anti-dive and is bump steer corrected. Ride comfort was preserved or improved, or full race handling is achieved with the correct shock dampening and 325# spring rates seem to suit my driving style. Of course changing ride height and or weight jacking (or transferring) is a snap with the coil-over system. I lowered my car 3 inches with the set up mentioned

    Lateral acceleration figures in excess of one 'G' have been recorded with this system, using Falcon street tires 245/17 X 8.5 on Momo rims and the 325# spring rates. I don’t think Wilwood system will work with the standard Fiero brake spindles, the 12" Super Duty Wilwood brake system used would twist off the suspension on a stock Fiero under high braking loads. For looks I used a high quality black powder coat finish on all fabricated parts in this package. To me this is the ultimate Fiero front suspension system.


    Additional Parts: Installation of above suspension components
    by a guy form, Sun Coast Fieros, $1,000.00

    My car is now a 355 Spider Design so I added a center “X” frame to stiffen chassis between the wheels under cockpit, $550.00 for parts, $150.00 for shop to weld it in place. The only thing I dislike about the “X” brace is the loss of 2 inches of ground clearance.

    If you need additional information, please contact me.

    Dave

    Note:

    You can use 84-86 Corvette Rotors with late model Camero Calipers and a bracket made from 3/8 in steel plate. These parts are readily available for those who do not want to use Wilwood brakes on their cars.
    If you're not confused, you're not paying attention.

  3. #3
    Senior Member hillsj's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    104

    Re: alternate hubs for rear '88 knuckles??

    I converted to the '88 cradle to avoid mentioned bump-steer problems and would prefer to keep as I paid a significant amount (to me anyway)of money to get the +4" held coil over '88 setup. Also already paid for custom axles. Of course I paid too much at $600 a pair. just wondered if there was an "easy" hub swap. I am sure held could set me up but the cost of their brakes seems high. I guess those 315/35/R17 will just stay a dream. '88 - '96 ZR1 wheels are 17" 11" wide with 50mm offset. I would love a slalom front end but House, wife, kids means limited budget. As an alternative I could look into changing the offset of the wheels I have. Not sure I would trust welding the bolt holes solid. milling off say 50mm (75mm total) and redrilling the bolt holes on the wheels.
    What was I thinking??!!  I could have a VR4 Spyder for this kind of money.

  4. #4
    Moderator FunnyWheels's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    8,151

    Re: alternate hubs for rear '88 knuckles??

    I will only have to weld one bolt hole on my front hubs. I just have to drill the new holes where the metal is between the exisiting studs. There is only one area that has a hole in it to pass a wrench into to tighten up the hub to the upright. I could use a flat wrench to get er done with the new studs. I use ARP 3 inch studs in mine with special lug nuts.
    If you're not confused, you're not paying attention.

  5. #5
    Senior Member hillsj's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    104

    Re: alternate hubs for rear '88 knuckles??

    you are talking about welding/drilling the hub. I am considering the wheel itself to change its offset. there is a ton of material there but it is countersunk about 3" and uses very long lug nuts.
    What was I thinking??!!  I could have a VR4 Spyder for this kind of money.

  6. #6
    Moderator FunnyWheels's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    8,151

    Re: alternate hubs for rear '88 knuckles??

    I am talking about redrilling the brake rotor and hub assembly, not the rim. There is plenty of meat on my hubs and rotors to fix my problem.

    Yours might be similar. It is worth a try rather than messing up the rims.
    Attached Images Attached Images    
    If you're not confused, you're not paying attention.

  7. #7
    Senior Member hillsj's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    104

    Re: alternate hubs for rear '88 knuckles??

    I could probably redrill to 5x4.5 but not 5x4.75. I assume you need a wheel shop to do this. Most people don't have a hydraulic press laying around to insert or remove the bolts. I had wanted to go 5x4.75 but maybe the 5x4.5 will work. how hard is it to get the hub in/out of the knuckle. as long as I am doing it would I be better off getting new hubs? thanks for all the help.
    What was I thinking??!!  I could have a VR4 Spyder for this kind of money.

Similar Threads

  1. Alternate coilovers.......... :) Just a thought
    By Bottlefed in forum Technical Discussion & Question
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 08-20-2011, 01:13 AM
  2. WTB HD Uprights (Knuckles)
    By msaby in forum The Mall
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 01-23-2011, 05:04 PM
  3. rcc front hubs
    By yannie in forum The Mall
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 02-26-2007, 06:02 AM
  4. 1987 rear hubs
    By Ferrari Berlinetta in forum The Mall
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 03-13-2004, 05:43 PM
  5. NEW Street Dreams aluminum lowering knuckles and multi-pattern hubs
    By Wills Fiero in forum General Kitcar Chat
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-08-2003, 09:27 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •